{"id":481,"date":"2014-09-14T14:12:29","date_gmt":"2014-09-14T18:12:29","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/press.nbcnews.com\/?p=481"},"modified":"2014-09-14T14:12:29","modified_gmt":"2014-09-14T18:12:29","slug":"meet-the-press-91414-mcdonough-on-war-with-isil-baker-says-plan-has-problems-sanders-on-2016-gumbel-on-nfl-new-poll","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/nbcuniversalnewsgroup.com\/nbcnews\/2014\/09\/14\/meet-the-press-91414-mcdonough-on-war-with-isil-baker-says-plan-has-problems-sanders-on-2016-gumbel-on-nfl-new-poll\/","title":{"rendered":"\u201cMeet the Press\u201d 9\/14\/14 — McDonough on \u201cWar With ISIL;\u201d Baker Says Plan Has \u201cProblems;\u201d Sanders on 2016; Gumbel on NFL; New Poll"},"content":{"rendered":"
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McDonough: \u201cIn as much as we’ve been at war with Al Qaeda since we got here, we’re at war with ISIL\u201d Baker: Obama ISIS plan has \u201cgot some problems with it\u201d New Poll: 70% of Americans Lack Confidence in Obama Mission to Destroy ISIS Gumbel: \u201cThe NFL\u2019s good at masquerading.\u201d<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n
<\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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SEPTEMBER 14, 2014 — Today\u2019s \u201cMeet the Press with Chuck Todd\u201d<\/strong> featured interviews with White House Chief of Staff Denis McDonough<\/strong> and former Secretary of State James Baker<\/strong> on the President\u2019s ISIS strategy; the kickoff of the 2016 \u201cMeet the Candidate\u201d series with Senator\u00a0Bernie Sanders<\/strong> (I-VT); a panel discussion with the Washington Post<\/em>\u2019s Nia-Malika Henderson<\/strong>, the New York Times\u2019<\/em>\u00a0\u00a0Helene Cooper<\/strong>, POLITICO\u2019s Jim VandeHei<\/strong>, and Republican strategist\u00a0Mike Murphy<\/strong>; plus a conversation on the NFL with Bryant Gumbel<\/strong>, host of HBO\u2019s \u201cReal Sports.\u201d<\/p>\n

The program also featured live interviews with NBC News correspondents Richard Engel<\/strong> in Erbil, Iraq and Bill Neely<\/strong> in Damascus, Syria; and a report from Iowa ahead of the Harkin steak fry from Andrea Mitchell<\/strong>.<\/p>\n

Chuck also unveiled a new NBC News\/WSJ\/Annenberg poll<\/strong> which indicates a large majority of Americans lack confidence in the president\u2019s mission to destroy ISIS.\u00a0 Mark Murray\u2019s full analysis is online here: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1y1SIiT<\/a><\/p>\n

Below are highlights, video, and a rush transcript of today\u2019s program. All content will be available online at MeetThePressNBC.com<\/a>.<\/p>\n

# # #<\/strong><\/p>\n

McDonough on semantics of \u201cwar\u201d on ISIS: \u201cin as much as we’ve been at war with Al Qaeda since we got here, we’re at war with ISIL\u201d<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/X26znU<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: There seem to be this debate about semantics, between The Pentagon, Josh Earnest.\u00a0 Why now are you calling it a war on ISIS, and why has the President been so hesitant to refer to it as a war?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH: Oh, I don’t think the President told you it was not a war, Chuck.\u00a0 You asked him if he was preparing the country for war.\u00a0 And he said he was preparing the country for this effort against ISIL.\u00a0 And that’s exactly what we’re doing.\u00a0 And there was no debate between The Pentagon and the White House.\u00a0 And you heard Secretary Kerry, The Pentagon, and Josh on Friday underscore that in as much as we’ve been at war with Al Qaeda since we got here, we’re at war with ISIL.<\/p>\n

McDonough: \u201cSuccess looks like an ISIL that no longer threatens our friends in the region\u201d<\/strong><\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH: We’re going to lead an international effort against ISIL.\u00a0 But this is not going to be easy.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: What does success look like?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH: Success looks like an ISIL that no longer threatens our friends in the region, no longer threatens the United States.\u00a0 An ISIL that can’t accumulate followers, or threaten Muslims in Syria, Iran, Iraq, or otherwise.\u00a0 And that’s exactly what success looks like.<\/p>\n

McDonough confirms no country in coalition has pledged combat troops on the ground<\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:\u00a0 Is there a single country in this coalition so far that has pledged combat troops on the ground in Syria?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:\u00a0 Well, you will hear from Secretary Kerry on this over the coming days.\u00a0 And what he has said is that others have suggested that they’re willing to do that.\u00a0 But we’re not looking for that right now.\u00a0 We’re looking for–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: Wait a minute.\u00a0 Why not?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH: –the specifics– well, we’re trying to put together the specifics of what we expect from each of the members.\u00a0 And that’s what we’ll build against.\u00a0 That’s what the President will be talking with John Allen about later this week.\u00a0 He’s sitting down with him on Tuesday, as we begin to put this coalition together in very concrete fashion.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: But there’s not a single military advisor that has come to you guys and said, “You can defeat ISIS without some combat troops.\u00a0 ISIS in Syria, without some combat troops.”<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH: That’s correct.<\/p>\n

McDonough: \u201cWe need ground troops, that’s why we want this program to train the opposition\u201d<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1s2948d<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: Can you pledge for sure that there will never be American combat troops on the ground in Syria?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH: You’ve heard what the President said, Chuck, including his address to the country on Wednesday.\u00a0 This is an effort that, like in Yemen and Somalia, where we will take the fight to our enemies without putting our ground troops into the effort.\u00a0 We need ground troops, that’s why we want this program to train the opposition, that’s currently pending in Congress.\u00a0 And that’s why we want to make sure that this coalition bring Sunnis to the fight.\u00a0 And that’s what we’re going to do.<\/p>\n

McDonough: President Obama was \u201cshocked by what he saw\u201d in Ray Rice video<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1wkNIkF<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: Have you spoken with the President?\u00a0 Have you guys talked about this Ray Rice situation in the NFL?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:\u00a0 We have talked generally about the situation in the NFL.\u00a0 And the President was shocked by what he saw, let’s put it that way.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: And how does he think the NFL’s handled this?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH: I don’t want to get into a characterization of that right now.\u00a0 But I think we all know that Ray Rice being suspended indefinitely seems to be exactly the right thing.<\/p>\n

James Baker: President Obama\u2019s ISIS plan has \u201cgot some problems\u201d<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1q3T1iK<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: Let me start with this, the President’s plan.\u00a0 Is it the right plan?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER: Well, that’s the President’s plan, so it better be the right plan.\u00a0 It’s got some problems with it.\u00a0 And your panel was just talking about some of those.\u00a0 The biggest, of course, is who are our, quote, “partners on the ground” that the President referred to in his speech.\u00a0 And I don’t know where they come from.<\/p>\n

Baker predicts \u201cU.S. special ops forces and people like that on the ground\u201d<\/strong><\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER: I’m not– well, I’m not suggesting that we need to get into another ground war in the Middle East.\u00a0 But I’m just saying we cannot do this without having some forces on the ground that can help our air campaign.\u00a0 You have to have that.\u00a0 And I’m afraid to say what I think it’s going to be.\u00a0 It’s going to be U.S. special ops forces and people like that on the ground.\u00a0 Because we don’t have any other forces being offered to us.<\/p>\n

Baker: \u201cThese conflicts foment terrorism\u201d<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/Zloub8<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER: We’ve got to prove that we’re not jumping in on the side of the Shia in this fight between the Shia and the Sunni. And so we need to have Sunni support.\u00a0 If we bring Iran in at this point we’ll lose that Sunni support.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: So the coalition focus should be all Sunni?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER: For this purpose, for this purpose.\u00a0 In the long-term, in the long-term — the Middle East is mired in turmoil.\u00a0 Everywhere you look.\u00a0 And in the long-term somebody’s going to have to organize a negotiation, or a conference, or something, to deal with these conflicts.\u00a0 Because these conflicts foment terrorism.<\/p>\n

Bernie Sanders: \u201cI am thinking about running for president \u2026 running as a Democrat\u2014that\u2019s something that I\u2019m looking at right now.\u201d<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1pfzjAs<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: Are you about to switch parties? Are you going to become a member of the Democratic Party if you pursue this presidential campaign?<\/p>\n

SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS: Well, I am the longest-serving independent in the history of the United States Congress. That\u2019s how I\u2019ve always won in the state of Vermont. I am thinking about running for president and the issue of whether you run as an independent with the necessity of setting up the fifty-state infrastructure\u2026 running as a Democrat\u2014that\u2019s something that I\u2019m looking at right now.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: And you\u2019ve \u2013 it sounds like you\u2019ve ruled out running as an independent or you have not? You could end up doing it that way?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS: One of the reasons I\u2019m going to Iowa is to get a sense of how people feel about it. Look\u2014the truth is, profound anger at both political parties, more and more people are becoming independent, the negative is, how do you set up a fifty-state infrastructure as an independent?<\/p>\n

Sanders: \u201cLet Hillary speak for herself.\u201d<\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: Are you separating out Hillary Clinton from this? If she were speaking more robustly on these issues, would you be thinking about running?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS: Chuck, the issue is not Hillary. I-I\u2019ve known Hillary Clinton for many years. I have a lot of respect for Hillary Clinton. The question is: At a time when so many people have seen a decline in their standard of living, when the wealthiest people and largest corporations are doing phenomenally well, the American people want change. They want Congress, they want candidates, to stand up to the big money interests. So, let Hillary speak for herself. I know where I\u2019m coming from.<\/p>\n

Gumbel: \u201cThe NFL\u2019s very good at masquerading.\u201d<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/X27xAD<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: What should they be doing to prove that, you know what, they take domestic violence seriously?\u00a0 \u2026 They do October, you do breast cancer awareness.\u00a0 If they do that again this coming October it’s going to scream out of touch to me.<\/p>\n

BRYANT GUMBEL:
\nYeah, I agree with you.\u00a0 But they’re going to pink-wash once again.\u00a0 They’re going to wrap themselves, it’s what they do best.\u00a0 They sell their image very, very well.\u00a0 They sell that they’re sensitive to women, wrap themselves in pink.\u00a0 And yet they don’t punish domestic violence.\u00a0 They suggest they care about players’ safety, yet only medical science and a team of lawyers force them to confront it.\u00a0 They care that they’re great citizens, and wrap themselves in the flag.\u00a0 And yet they operate, it might surprise many Americans, as a tax-exempt nonprofit.\u00a0 The NFL’s very good at masquerading.<\/p>\n

Gumbel: \u201cUntil and unless you start hitting the NFL in a language it understands, which is money, very little’s going to change.\u201d<\/strong>
\nVIDEO: http:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1qUsUP2<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD: Should the owners take some responsibility here?\u00a0\u00a0 I mean, he serves at the pleasure of the owners.\u00a0 And I assume that the owners start losing money, then suddenly they might act.<\/p>\n

BRYANT GUMBEL: Bingo.\u00a0 Bingo.\u00a0 You saw, as I did, that the female senators sent a letter the other day to Roger Goodell complaining.\u00a0 I would suggest that anybody who really wants to complain should instead complain to Gatorade, Anheuser-Busch, FedEx, Ford Motor Company.\u00a0 Because until and unless you start hitting the NFL in a language it understands, which is money, very little’s going to change.<\/p>\n

# # # \u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

Complete video clips from today\u2019s program:<\/strong><\/p>\n

Richard Engel on the ISIS threat: Beheading \u2018Message to the World’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1s4xoAq<\/a><\/p>\n

Bill Neely: Syria Wants Information on Airstrikes
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1pfz6gE<\/a><\/p>\n

Denis McDonough: ISIS ‘a War We Have to Win’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/X26znU<\/a><\/p>\n

Denis McDonough: ‘We Need Ground Troops’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1s2948d<\/a><\/p>\n

McDonough: Obama ‘Shocked’ By Rice Video
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1wkNIkF<\/a><\/p>\n

Helene Cooper: White House ‘Trying to Thread the Needle’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/X26Lna<\/a><\/p>\n

Mike Murphy: Too Much Caution Leads to ‘Paralysis’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1qAg1Ms<\/a><\/p>\n

Jim VandeHei: U.S. Already Has ‘Boots on the Ground’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1uxoS1u<\/a><\/p>\n

Nia-Malika Henderson: ISIS Is the New al Qaeda
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1q3T1iK<\/a><\/p>\n

James Baker: We Need People on Ground in Mideast
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1q3T1iK<\/a><\/p>\n

James Baker on MTP: ‘We Need to Have Sunni Support’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/Zloub8<\/a><\/p>\n

James Baker: Mideast Problems Not About Placing Blame
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1m63sHD<\/a><\/p>\n

Baker on Mideast 1991 vs. 2014
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1oL9KIe<\/a><\/p>\n

Andrea Mitchell: Hillary Returns to Iowa
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1BDPD71<\/a><\/p>\n

Bernie Sanders: Americans ‘Want Real Change’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1pfzjAs<\/a><\/p>\n

Bernie Sanders Talks Today’s Democratic Party
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1m63wa9<\/a><\/p>\n

Jim VandeHei: Not Sure If Hillary and Democratic Party Have Same Views
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1tTNcMy<\/a><\/p>\n

Nia Malika Henderson Describes Hillary vs. Non-Hillarys
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1pfziwD<\/a><\/p>\n

Mike Murphy: Hillary Clinton ‘Not An Impressive Candidate’
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/Zlozvt<\/a><\/p>\n

Inside the Numbers: Democrats Struggle to Win Over Voters
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/YIHkZC<\/a><\/p>\n

Bryant Gumbel on NFL: No Reason to Suspect Goodell Will Be Fired
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/XigUN6<\/a><\/p>\n

Gumbel: NFL\u2019s Good at Masquerading
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/X27xAD<\/a><\/p>\n

Gumbel on NFL: It’s About the Money
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1qUsUP2<\/a><\/p>\n

Helene Cooper: NFL Situation Says More About Audience Than League
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1nVleJ6<\/a><\/p>\n

What Everyone in Washington Knows\u2026 Do Both Sides Secretly Want to Lose the Senate?
\nhttp:\/\/nbcnews.to\/1tRBZIp<\/a><\/p>\n

# # #<\/p>\n

Below is a RUSH transcript of this morning\u2019s broadcast — mandatory attribution to NBC News\u2019 \u201cMeet the Press.\u201d A final transcript of the program will be available at www.MeetThePressNBC.com.<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cMEET THE PRESS WITH CHUCK TODD\u201d<\/strong>
\nSeptember 14, 2014<\/strong><\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThis Sunday, on Meet the Press, President Obama makes it clear this country is in for the long haul.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT OBAMA (ON TAPE):
\nWe will degrade and ultimately destroy ISIL.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBut suggests this isn\u2019t a war the U.S. can win alone.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT OBAMA (ON TAPE):
\nA broad coalition to roll back this terrorist threat.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nJames Baker, the man who built the alliance that forced Saddam Hussein out of Kuwait, will tell me if he thinks President Obama\u2019s plan will work.<\/p>\n

And Hillary Clinton visits Iowa today. Many see it as day one of her campaign.<\/p>\n

ANDY DUFFLEMEYER (ON TAPE):
\nI\u2019m looking for someone who\u2019s a little more liberal.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBut is she really as much of a sure thing as some people think? Plus, the NFL in crisis: Growing calls for Roger Goodell to resign over his handling of the Ray Rice case. How big a problem is domestic violence in this country? And what everyone in Washington knows, but is afraid to say.<\/p>\n

I\u2019m Chuck Todd, and joining me this morning to provide insight and analysis are Republican strategist Mike Murphy, Helene Cooper of The New York Times, Nia-Malika Henderson of The Washington Post, Jim VandeHei of POLITICO and Bryant Gumbel of HBO\u2019s Real Sports. Welcome to Sunday, it\u2019s Meet the Press.<\/p>\n

ANNOUNCER:
\nFrom NBC News in Washington, this is Meet the Press with Chuck Todd<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nGood Sunday Morning. ISIS\u2019 response to president obama was savage and depressingly predictable. Yesterday they released a video showing the killing of a British aid worker, David Haines.<\/p>\n

Earlier this week the president used a primetime address to reassure a fearful American public that he is taking the threat posed by ISIS as seriously as they are.<\/p>\n

Crucially though, he has promised not to commit American troops to fight in Syria or Iraq. Instead he’s calling for airstrikes and providing weaponry and training to forces on the ground who are fighting ISIS.<\/p>\n

By the way, it’s striking that President Obama sounded like his predecessor, George W Bush despite their differences on Iraq. When it comes to taking on terrorism their rhetoric is strikingly similar.<\/p>\n

***Begin Tape***<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT OBAMA:
\nTrained and battle-hardened, these fighters could try to return to their home countries and carry out deadly attacks.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH:
\nThey are sent back to their homes or sent to hide in countries around the world to plot evil and destruction.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT OBAMA:
\nThe United States of America will continue to do what we must do to protect our people.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH:
\nWe will take defensive measures against terrorism to protect Americans.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT OBAMA:
\nISIL is not “Islamic.”<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH:
\nThese acts of violence against innocents violate the fundamental tenets of the Islamic faith.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT OBAMA:
\nIt will take time to eradicate a cancer like ISIL
\nPRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH:
\nAmericans should not expect one battle, but a lengthy campaign …<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT OBAMA:
\nIf you threaten America, you will find no safe haven.<\/p>\n

PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH:
\nWe continue to pursue the terrorists in cities and camps and caves across the earth.<\/p>\n

***End Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThe fact is, they are pursuing similar policies now. Secretary of State John Kerry has been putting the hard sell for help in the Middle East over the last few days. But it’s not clear how many countries will help and how much they’ll contribute.<\/p>\n

And check this out, we have some brand new poll numbers out this morning, that show that the American people support President Obama\u2019s plan to attack ISIS and at the same time are deeply skeptical that the plan will actually work.<\/p>\n

For all this I’m joined by NBC’s Chief Correspondent, Richard Engel, who was in Erbil, Iraq, this morning.\u00a0 And Bill Neely, our Chief Global Correspondent who is in Damascus.\u00a0 Richard, let me start with you.\u00a0 First, I want to get to this killing of the British aid worker here.\u00a0 The message that ISIS is trying to send.\u00a0 I saw your report last night.\u00a0 You believe they’re trying to send a message to another country, not Britain, not the United States.\u00a0 Who is it?<\/p>\n

RICHARD ENGEL:
\nIt’s a message to the world.\u00a0 It’s a propaganda message, primarily.\u00a0 But it is also a very specific message, it seems, to Turkey.\u00a0 ISIS is holding more than 40 Turkish diplomats hostage.\u00a0 Turkey has been very sensitive about this issue.\u00a0 It’s actually illegal in Turkey to talk about the subject.<\/p>\n

And Turkey has been very reluctant to join this coalition, at least publicly, with the United States.\u00a0 Turkey would be essential.\u00a0 It’s right on the border.\u00a0 If the U.S. wants to organize an effective campaign to build the free Syrian army, it probably has to be done through Turkey.\u00a0 And this is one way for ISIS to say, “If Turkey joins its diplomats are at risk.”<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd arguably Turkey has the best military in the region.\u00a0 Now let’s talk about where you are, on the ground in Iraq.\u00a0 The Iraqi military, President Obama is essentially relying on the Iraqi military to step up on the ground to avoid sending American combat troops.\u00a0 What are you seeing on the ground?<\/p>\n

RICHARD ENGEL:
\nWe are seeing the Iraqi military not stepping up.\u00a0 This is an enormous military, trained by the United States to the tune of $25 billion.\u00a0 I remember so many times speaking to American generals who were here saying, “The Iraqi army is ready.”\u00a0 Well, the Iraqi army was not ready.\u00a0 The Iraqi army has not been able to push out ISIS.<\/p>\n

It hasn’t been able to take back one province in this country.\u00a0 And many people are questioning the loyalty of the Iraqi army.\u00a0 They say that it is deeply influenced by Iran.\u00a0 So now the Americans are flying overhead, dropping bombs, doing American air strikes.\u00a0 And you have the Iraqi army, ineffective, and guided by Iran.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAll right.\u00a0 Richard Engel, in Erbil, Iraq this morning.\u00a0 Richard, thanks very much.\u00a0 I want to go to Damascus, where Bill Neely is.\u00a0 And Bill, Assad, you’ve been speaking with some of Assad’s aids about the President’s plan here.\u00a0 Is Assad happy with the President’s plan?\u00a0 Does Assad see this is as an opportunity to end up winning this civil war?<\/p>\n

BILL NEELY:
\nWell, President Assad’s men welcome U.S. air strikes.\u00a0 But they say they want those strikes coordinated with them, so that U.S. war planes aren’t shot out of the sky by Syrian war planes.\u00a0 Those Syrian war planes have been in action just behind me on the edge of Damascus this morning.<\/p>\n

Attacking not ISIS positions, but another rebel group allied to Al Qaeda.\u00a0 So, as you say, we’ve had the rhetoric from President Obama.\u00a0 Now comes the reality of those difficult choices.\u00a0 The killing of a hostage is designed to put pressure on President Obama.\u00a0 And he does face some hard choices.\u00a0 Now, when does he take action here in Syria?\u00a0 And where does he strike ISIS?<\/p>\n

Who are the moderate rebels who might retake the ground after U.S. air strikes?\u00a0 So it’s certainly pressure on President Obama now, to deliver on intentions here in Syria.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBill Neely, in Damascus for us.\u00a0 Bill, thanks very much.\u00a0 Stay safe as you travel in that country. Well, you heard live reports there in Iraq, and in Syria.\u00a0 A little earlier I spoke to White House Chief of Staff, Denis McDonough.<\/p>\n

***Begin Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nDenis McDonough, welcome back to Meet The Press.<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nThanks Chuck, thanks for having me.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nLet me start with this issue of terminology, for some reason.\u00a0 I asked the President last week about whether he was preparing the country for war.\u00a0 He pushed back.\u00a0 Said, “This is not a war.”\u00a0 He’s not used the terminology “war” in his speech on Wednesday, nor in the video address.\u00a0 And yet there seem to be this debate about semantics, between The Pentagon, Josh Earnest.\u00a0 Why now are you calling it a war on ISIS, and why has the President been so hesitant to refer to it as a war?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nOh, I don’t think the President told you it was not a war, Chuck.\u00a0 You asked him if he was preparing the country for war.\u00a0 And he said he was preparing the country for this effort against ISIL.\u00a0 And that’s exactly what we’re doing.\u00a0 And there was no debate between The Pentagon and the White House.\u00a0 And you heard Secretary Kerry, The Pentagon, and Josh on Friday underscore that inasmuch as we’ve been at war with Al Qaeda since we got here, we’re at war with ISIL.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBut you’ve been, I mean, this is something that Democrats in general, you don’t like to refer to this attack on Al Qaeda as a war.\u00a0 You didn’t like the phrase “War on terror.”\u00a0 I mean, is that what this is about?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nWell, no Chuck.\u00a0 I think you’re confusing our position with maybe a generalization about something else.\u00a0 The fact is, going back to 2007, the President has called the war against Al Qaeda “the war we need to win.”\u00a0 And this effort against ISIL is something that we’ll undertake with a broad coalition of nations, Muslim and otherwise.\u00a0 And it’s something not like the war in Iraq, where we’re going to have hundreds of thousands of ground troops in the effort.\u00a0 But rather this is something that’s going to be concerted, targeted.\u00a0 And it’s a war we have to win.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWe’ve got some polling that we’re just releasing this morning.\u00a0 Sixty-two percent of the country supports what the President wants to do, and 68 percent don’t believe it will work.\u00a0 Why do you think that the public is supportive, but skeptical that this will work?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nWell, look, this is obviously a complicated effort.\u00a0 And that’s why the President is going about this in a very painstaking, and very prudent fashion.\u00a0 That’s why the Secretary of State is now just continuing his efforts to travel throughout the region to get others to join us in this effort.\u00a0 And that’s what we’re going to do.\u00a0 We’re going to lead an international effort against ISIL.\u00a0 But this is not going to be easy.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWhat does success look like?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nSuccess looks like an ISIL that no longer threatens our friends in the region, no longer threatens the United States.\u00a0 An ISIL that can’t accumulate followers, or threaten Muslims in Syria, Iran, Iraq, or otherwise.\u00a0 And that’s exactly what success looks like.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nHe held up Yemen and Somalia as good examples.\u00a0 It’s hard to look at those countries and say that they’re pictures of stability.<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nHe held up Yemen and Somalia as examples of how we carry this out.\u00a0 This is something that we will do using our precise airborne capabilities.\u00a0 Supporting non-U.S., that is to say Syrian opposition or Iraqi soldiers on the ground, taking the fight to ISIL.\u00a0 So he’s holding them up as examples of how we will do this.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nIs there a single country in this coalition so far that has pledged combat troops on the ground in Syria?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nWell, you will hear from Secretary Kerry on this over the coming days.\u00a0 And what he has said is that others have suggested that they’re willing to do that.\u00a0 But we’re not looking for that right now.\u00a0 We’re looking for–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWait a minute.\u00a0 Why not?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\n–the specifics– well, we’re trying to put together the specifics of what we expect from each of the members.\u00a0 And that’s what we’ll build against.\u00a0 That’s what the President will be talking with John Allen about later this week.\u00a0 He’s sitting down with him on Tuesday, as we begin to put this coalition together in very concrete fashion.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBut there’s not a single military advisor that has come to you guys and said, “You can defeat ISIS without some combat troops.\u00a0 ISIS in Syria, without some combat troops.”<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nThat’s correct.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nRight?\u00a0 I mean, so, that’s a fact.<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nThat’s a fact.\u00a0 And that’s the President’s view.\u00a0 And that’s why what we need Congress to do right now, and frankly we’re seeing very good progress on this thanks to the Speaker and to others, is to put together support for what the President calls a “Title Ten” program, to train and equip the Syrian opposition on the ground, fighting ISIL.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBy the way, you bring that up, the President, very skeptical of this moderate opposition just a month ago in an interview with Tom Friedman.\u00a0 Now, suddenly, this is the great hope?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nI think you overstate the– I don’t think anybody called it the “great hope.”\u00a0 I think we all recognize that we need a ground force of Syrians, a Sunni force, on the ground, fighting ISIL in Syria.\u00a0 The same way we will have Iraqi forces on the ground in Iraq, fighting ISIL.\u00a0 But this is all going to be something that will be backed up by U.S. air power.\u00a0 And that will make a big difference.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nI guess I’m going to ask this another way.\u00a0 So if you know you need combat troops on the ground, you don’t have any countries that have pledged to do it yet.\u00a0 And I understand you’re saying some will come in.<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nI didn’t say that, Chuck.\u00a0 I said–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThere are countries that have pledged?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\n–that you will– you will– you will hear from Secretary Kerry that countries are saying that they’re ready to do that.\u00a0 And they’re ready to fly with us.\u00a0 But we’re going to get to that in due time.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nCan you pledge for sure that there will never be American combat troops on the ground in Syria?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nYou’ve heard what the President said, Chuck, including his address to the country on Wednesday.\u00a0 This is an effort that, like in Yemen and Somalia, where we will take the fight to our enemies without putting our ground troops into the effort.\u00a0 We need ground troops, that’s why we want this program to train the opposition, that’s currently pending in Congress.\u00a0 And that’s why we want to make sure that this coalition bring Sunnis to the fight.\u00a0 And that’s what we’re going to do.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nLet’s talk about the vote in Congress very quickly.\u00a0 The President has said about his plan for ISIS he wouldn’t mind if Congress weighs in, but that he has the authority.<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nHe didn’t say he wouldn’t mind.\u00a0 He said he’d welcome it.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nHe’d welcome it.\u00a0 Fair enough.\u00a0 That’s a different way of phrasing, I think, the same way.\u00a0 But a year ago he needed, he said he needed Congress behind him before he took any action in Syria.\u00a0 And this time he just simply welcomes it.\u00a0 But if they don’t do it, he’s going to do it anyway.\u00a0 Why the change?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nI’d say three things about this, Chuck.\u00a0 One, I came on this show almost exactly a year ago to warn about the threat of Syrian chemical weapons.\u00a0 Earlier this summer we succeeded in destroying the declared Syrian chemical weapons stockpile, which theretofore had been one of the world’s biggest.\u00a0 That’s point one.<\/p>\n

Point two, when I came on the show a year ago we did not have any statutory authorization that would underscore our effort to take the fight to Syria because of the chemical weapons.\u00a0 That’s why, and, by the way, what brought us into the middle of a civil war on Syria.\u00a0 We decided that we needed Congress to help us with that.\u00a0 Now we have a situation where, with the 2001 authorization, we have statutory authorization.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nIt’s funny that you want to use this authorization to do this, and you also want to change the authorization.\u00a0 Are you still going to pursue chancing that war authorization, rescinding it, and having a new one?\u00a0 Or are you delaying that push?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nThis has been something we are talking to Congress about.\u00a0 We’ll continue to talk to them about it.\u00a0 But that’s something that–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBut this is now in the backseat?\u00a0 You’re sort of punting that?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nThis is something we’ve been working with Congress.\u00a0 We’ll continue to work with Congress on.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAll right.\u00a0 Before I let you go, have you spoken with the President?\u00a0 Have you guys talked about this Ray Rice situation in the NFL?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nWe have talked generally about the situation in the NFL.\u00a0 And the President was shocked by what he saw, let’s put it that way.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd how does he think the NFL’s handled this?<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nI don’t want to get into a characterization of that right now.\u00a0 But I think we all know that Ray Rice being suspended indefinitely seems to be exactly the right thing.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nDenis McDonough, White House Chief of Staff, thanks for coming on Meet The Press.<\/p>\n

DENIS MCDONOUGH:
\nThanks for having me, Chuck.<\/p>\n

***End Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAll right, let’s get some reaction from our panel.\u00a0 Mike Murphy, Helene Cooper, Nia-Malika Henderson, Jim VandeHei.\u00a0 Helene, let me start with you.\u00a0 You said something interesting when I talked to you about the poll numbers.\u00a0 Basically 62 percent in favor of taking action, and 68 percent skeptical that the plan will work.\u00a0 And you said somebody else had that same feeling.<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nWell, President Obama, I think is– this interview with Dennis was just really interesting.\u00a0 Because he seems like he’s trying to thread this needle so finely.\u00a0 I think when we saw President Obama come out last week, you know, talking about this core coalition.\u00a0 And talking about this plan to somehow train these moderate Syrian opposition on the ground.<\/p>\n

I think he believes in the core coalition, and he believes in what he’s doing.\u00a0 I’m not so sure, I think there’s a lot of skepticism within the administration about this plan on training up the Syrian opposition, because I mean just months ago we didn’t know who these people were.\u00a0 There’s still a belief that some of them may have been the ones who turned over these Americans–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThe weapons.\u00a0 Some have traded an American to ISIS–<\/p>\n

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON:
\nYes, yeah, to ISIS, to begin with.\u00a0 So the idea that suddenly the free Syrian army is going to turn into, you know, the Kurdish Peshmerga, even, seems a little bit far-fetched.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd Murphy, I get the sense that they wish, you know, if it wasn’t for Iraq we’d have a more robust military plan.\u00a0 We wouldn’t be ruling out combat troops.\u00a0 I understand, politically, why they have to.\u00a0 Because there would be no support in Congress for it, and no support in the public for it.\u00a0 But they don’t know how to do this without it.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nI want to call Vegas and get the line on the moderate opposition’s war-fighting capacity.\u00a0 (LAUGHS) Because that’s been a bad–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThe President himself said they’re dentists.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nYeah.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nI mean, nothing wrong with that.\u00a0 Revolutionaries, you know, they’re trying.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nI think his problem is that the premise of his campaign in 2008, where he took on Hillary Clinton from the left, had a lot of na\u00efve assumptions about foreign policy.\u00a0 You can’t opt out of being the only superpower.\u00a0 And caution is a good thing, but too much caution turns into paralysis.\u00a0 There was opportunity to act earlier, here there’s not.<\/p>\n

Now he’s lurching in the right direction.\u00a0 But long-term it’s a political problem, it could take a generation to fix.\u00a0 Short-term, defining what victory is in this, with limited American arms, that have been highly de-funded under this administration, is very difficult.\u00a0 And now he’s paying that price.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd, VandeHei, I mean, it is sort of collective.\u00a0 Washington seems to be in the same place as the public.\u00a0 Supportive, they want to do something.\u00a0 But nobody thinks this plan is the best plan.<\/p>\n

JIM VANDEHEI:
\nAnd no wonder that the President is conflicted, privately.\u00a0 If you look at that poll, that’s exactly what the President thinks.\u00a0 And the truth is he can’t say what the truth is, which is there’s not even a glorious win to the war that you finally got them to ascribe as a war.\u00a0 Even if you play it out, and say they get exactly what they want, and they purge the Islamic state from Syria.<\/p>\n

What are you left with?\u00a0 You’re left with Assad, who’s brutalized and killed 200,000 people.\u00a0 Who videotaped rolling over the heads of their victims.\u00a0 And you’ve created a state, the Jordanian state, where it’s basically an untenable refugee camp.\u00a0 It’s a mess.\u00a0 And that’s why you see this confliction.<\/p>\n

And one of the things that I think people want to see from the President is just more clarity.\u00a0 Call it what it is.\u00a0 My brother-in-law was in the military, was in Baghdad.\u00a0 And one of the frustration he voices is there are boots on the ground.\u00a0 What do you think the military advisors are, sanitation specialists?\u00a0 No.\u00a0 They’re often the elite forces, the hardest to find, the hardest to keep alive, the hardest to train.\u00a0 And they’re there.\u00a0 And I think that’s where you get a lot of the frustration with the whole thing.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nAnd I think, you know, that’s the issue here is that we just don’t know.\u00a0 Even if we win here, there’s going to be something else that fills this vacuum.\u00a0 Which I think that’s what the public is being so skeptical.<\/p>\n

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON:
\nThat’s right.\u00a0 That’s right.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nWe just know after ISIS it’ll be something else.<\/p>\n

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON:
\nYeah.\u00a0 And that’s what we’ve seen, right?\u00a0 I mean, the Iraq war, there were all sorts of promises made about what the outcome would be over that.\u00a0 And routing Al Qaeda.\u00a0 But, guess what, there’s a new Al Qaeda, and it’s bigger, it’s badder, it’s more well-funded, and it’s called ISIS.\u00a0 So you see this public that has watched over these last 13 years, in the wake of 9\/11, see people on television making promises that just haven’t come to pass.\u00a0 So no wonder they’re skeptical.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nPerfectly rational, to me, for the public to react that way.\u00a0 I think all of us have that same feeling, ’cause you just don’t know how this ends.\u00a0 You guys are going to be sticking with me.\u00a0 We’ll have more to come.\u00a0 We’ll hear more from you later.\u00a0 Coming up, though, the President’s plan to defeat ISIS.\u00a0 Can it work?\u00a0 I’m going to be joined by the architect of the US-led coalition that liberated Kuwait from Saddam Hussein in the early ’90s, none other than Secretary of State, Jim Baker.<\/p>\n

***Commercial Break***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWelcome back.\u00a0 Joining me now to discuss President Obama’s strategy to combat ISIS is James Baker.\u00a0 And this is James Baker– Baker was Secretary of State under President George H. W.\u00a0 Bush.\u00a0 During the first Gulf War in the early ’90s, and played a key role putting together the coalition to take on Iraq’s Saddam Hussein, and liberate Kuwait.<\/p>\n

He has one of the deepest government resumes ever.\u00a0 He served as White House Chief of Staff under Ronald Reagan.\u00a0 Going on to serve as Secretary of Treasury in Reagan’s second term.\u00a0 And after serving as Secretary of State for Bush 41, he finished up that term becoming his chief of staff.\u00a0 And this is James Baker’s 28th appearance on the program.\u00a0 And remarkably I’m apparently the 11th Meet The Press moderator to interview you.\u00a0 Secretary Baker, thanks for coming on this morning.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nA pleasure to be with you, Chuck.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAll right.\u00a0 Let me start with this, the President’s plan.\u00a0 Is it the right plan?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nWell, that’s the President’s plan, so it better be the right plan.\u00a0 It’s got some problems with it.\u00a0 And your panel was just talking about some of those.\u00a0 The biggest, of course, is who are our, quote, “partners on the ground” that the President referred to in his speech.\u00a0 And I don’t know where they come from.\u00a0 When we did this in 1991, that is built a coalition to accomplish something in the Middle East.\u00a0 We–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\n200,000 troops you got–<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nFive hundred thousand.\u00a0 We had 500,000 U.S. troops.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nRight.\u00a0 And you had an additional–<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nIn Desert Storm.\u00a0 And then we had addition thousands of troops from other countries.\u00a0 So there wasn’t any question about our resolve on the part of those people we were trying to bring into the coalition.\u00a0 But everybody tells me, and I’m was in the marine corps, but I’m not a military man, a military expert.<\/p>\n

You’ve got to have some people on the ground.\u00a0 You can’t do this just with air power.\u00a0 And so we’ve got to have special ops forces, or we’ve got to have some people who can advise this ground force, if it’s the Iraqi army, who can collect intelligence.\u00a0 Who can guide air strikes.\u00a0 And if they’re not going to be Americans, who are they going to be?\u00a0 So we’re going to have to have some people on the ground.\u00a0 But we’re also going to have to have some people to take territory after the airstrike.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWell, and that’s this whole hope.\u00a0 The President himself was skeptical of this moderate Syrian opposition.\u00a0 So the other idea is you hope that it’s Sunni countries.\u00a0 Other Sunni countries that provide the boots on the combat troops.\u00a0 Where’s Saudi Arabia?\u00a0 Obviously it’s not coming.\u00a0 Obviously the Jordanians, the Emirates, the Turks, all of those military forces, all of whom built their militaries with U.S. money, by the way.\u00a0 Where are they?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nWell, they’re not here.\u00a0 And they may not be here because we’re not on the ground.\u00a0 Now–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nDo you think that’s the issue?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nI’m not– well, I’m not suggesting that we need to get into another ground war in the Middle East.\u00a0 But I’m just saying we cannot do this without having some forces on the ground that can help our air campaign.\u00a0 You have to have that.\u00a0 And I’m afraid to say what I think it’s going to be.\u00a0 It’s going to be U.S. special ops forces and people like that on the ground.\u00a0 Because we don’t have any other forces being offered to us.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nYou know, when you built your coalition, it was one of the things I read was talking about the controversy surrounding you wanted to bring Syria into your coalition.\u00a0 There were some that were skeptical of bringing in Syria.\u00a0 Today, that country that there is a debate about, do you bring in the coalition, is Iran.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nThat’s right.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nIf you were Secretary of State right now, would you be, because you were adamant saying you know what, they’re with us on this, we need them in the coalition.\u00a0 This was about Syria at the time.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nThat’s right.\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWould you be feeling the same way about Iran?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nWell, and, of course, they not only joined the coalition, they sent troops.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nAnd some of those troops fought.\u00a0 I would not do that today, with respect to Iran, for one reason.\u00a0 We’ve got to prove that we’re not jumping in on the side of the Shia in this fight between the Shia and the Sunni.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nAnd so we need to have Sunni support.\u00a0 If we bring Iran in at this point we’ll lose that Sunni support.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nSo the coalition focus should be all Sunni?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nFor this purpose, for this purpose.\u00a0 In the long-term, in the long-term, the Middle East is mired in turmoil.\u00a0 Everywhere you look.\u00a0 And in the long-term somebody’s going to have to organize a negotiation, or a conference, or something, to deal with these conflicts.\u00a0 Because these conflicts foment terrorism.<\/p>\n

And everybody in the region, every country in the region, or in the world for that matter, would like to see us take out ISIS.\u00a0 But after that’s over there’s going to be more coming if we don’t do this.\u00a0 We need to pull all the countries of the region together.\u00a0 We need to add the EU, Russia, China, and, of course, ourselves.<\/p>\n

And have a discussion, and a conference, and a negotiation over how we empower the moderate forces in the region.\u00a0 How we limit the extremists in the region.\u00a0 And how we do all of this without further enflaming the Shia\/Sunni conflict.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThe cloud of the Iraq war seems to color everything.\u00a0 It’s the reason why the President isn’t committing any combat troops into this right now.\u00a0 I know you’ve been asked this before, you chose, the Bush 41 administration, chose not to take out Saddam Hussein.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nDo you believe that if you had basically the ’90s would look like what we’re seeing today?<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nWell, we were afraid of that.\u00a0 That’s why we didn’t, you know, for two years after we left office, “Why didn’t you guys take care of Saddam when you had the chance?”\u00a0 Every time I’d go out and give a speech, or something, I’d get the question.\u00a0 Well, now people see why we didn’t.\u00a0 Because we were worried about this very thing happening.\u00a0 That there would be ethnic divisions, and that the country would split apart.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd this is exactly what I’m– so, Vice President, so I take it you don’t agree with Vice President Cheney who said this week again, if he had to do it over again he’d do the Iraq war again.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nWell, (LAUGHS) I don’t agree with this.\u00a0 I don’t agree that because they did the Iraq war is why we’re where we are.\u00a0 I think you can make the same argument about Obama’s failure to arm the Syrian opposition.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nEarlier.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nOr, yeah, or not leaving a residual force in Iraq.\u00a0 You can argue all those things about the past.\u00a0 The problem is we have a huge issue here.\u00a0 What do we do about it going forward?\u00a0 There’s no country in the world that could pull together the kind of conference, or negotiation I’m talking about, except the United States of America.\u00a0 And we need to do that.<\/p>\n

Whether we can still do that or not, I don’t know.\u00a0 When we put our coalition together we had 500,000 U.S. troops on the ground.\u00a0 We had a specific goal, within a limited timeframe.\u00a0 Kick Iraq out of Kuwait.\u00a0 And America was respected by its allies, and feared by its enemies.\u00a0 We’re not there anymore.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd oh by the way, you actually got the war paid for.\u00a0 Most of it paid for.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nWell, we got other people to pay for the war.\u00a0 That’s correct.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nJames Baker, former Secretary of State, thanks for coming on Meet The Press.<\/p>\n

JAMES BAKER:
\nThanks, Chuck.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAppreciate it.\u00a0 Coming up, we’ll do a little politics here.\u00a0 Hillary Clinton is making a big splash today in Iowa.\u00a0 Our own NBC News\u2019 Andrea Mitchell, though, finds she may not be the sure thing, again, that her supporters are imagining.<\/p>\n

***Commercial Break***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd welcome back.\u00a0 Let’s turn now to the race for 2016, because Hillary Clinton is making us, right?\u00a0 She’s done everything a potential candidate can be expected to do.\u00a0 Book tour, check.\u00a0 Paid speeches to pad the bank account before you start running, check.\u00a0 And she’s done nothing to stop the rumor mill.<\/p>\n

But you could argue that once she steps foot in Iowa later today, for the annual Tom Harkin Steak Fry, there truly is no turning back.\u00a0 And yet, as NBC News\u2019 Andrea Mitchell is going to be reporting, Hillary is finding that, once again, being the most prepared candidate with the best resume may not be enough for many in a Democratic party that is increasingly tilting to the left.<\/p>\n

***Begin Tape***<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL (V\/O):
\nFrom billboards, to posters, to campaign busses for the candidate-in-waiting, supports are flooding the state.\u00a0 They are ready for Hillary’s first appearance in Iowa in 2,446 days.\u00a0 Yes, they keep track of details like that here.\u00a0 A key strategy targeting young people. But at the Smokey Row Coffee House in Des Moines, Clinton has her work cut out for her, with some of the 20-somethings we caught up with.<\/p>\n

ANDY DUFFLEMEYER:
\nI’m looking for someone that’s a little bit more liberal.\u00a0 A little bit–<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nAndy Dufflemyer, a law student.<\/p>\n

ANDY DUFFLEMEYER:
\nMore on the edge of pushing some important issues, like climate change, and campaign finance reform, and– income inequality, and things like that.\u00a0 And I’m not sure that k– Hillary is that candidate.<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nCarla Bromwell works for a nonprofit.\u00a0 When you look at Hillary Clinton, what do you see first?\u00a0 A politician?\u00a0 A woman?\u00a0 A president?<\/p>\n

CARLA BROMWELL:
\nI think people see kind of the cronyism on Wall Street.\u00a0 And, I mean, her biggest supporters is Wall Street.\u00a0 And, you know, she’s currently on the circuit giving speeches to Goldman Sachs.\u00a0 And I just feel like regular people might see that as something that they’re not looking for anymore.<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nBut Caroline Carson, a college sophomore, thinks Clinton would get things done.<\/p>\n

CAROLINE CARSON:
\nShe actually wants to work across the aisle, and make sure that something would happen if she were to be President, rather than the gridlock we have currently.<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nLast time Team Clinton was stunned by the Obama forces.\u00a0 She even finished third in Iowa behind John Edwards.<\/p>\n

HILLARY CLINTON:
\nI am so ready for the rest of this campaign–<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nIt still hurts.<\/p>\n

HILLARY CLINTON:
\n–and I am so ready–<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nHere’s how she describes it in her new book, Hard Choices.<\/p>\n

HILLARY CLINTON:
\nThe night of the Iowa caucuses when I placed third was excruciating.<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nObama blitzed her on new media.\u00a0 This time Clinton supporters are trying to catch up on social media, and enlisting celebrities like Katie Perry, who posted on Instagram, “I told that Hillary Clinton that I would write her a theme song if she needs it.”\u00a0 Still, there’s a vision thing.<\/p>\n

IOWAN:
\nI feel like I don’t know who she is.\u00a0 And I do feel like maybe she’s a little malleable, in kind of a Mitt Romney sort of way.<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nBut especially with women voters, would gender trump all?<\/p>\n

IOWAN:
\nI would love to see the first woman President.\u00a0 But it doesn’t matter more to me than my progressive values.<\/p>\n

***End Tape***<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nAnd just in a few hours this field behind me, it’s going to be filled with more than 5,000 very enthusiastic democrats.\u00a0 But the Hillary Clinton skeptics I talked to, they still want Elizabeth Warren.\u00a0 They want Bernie Sanders.\u00a0 They want someone to push her to the left.\u00a0 And Bernie Sanders is going to be here in Iowa later tonight at a separate event, Chuck.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThere you go.\u00a0 Andrea, the scene of the crime, if you’re a Clinton supporter, back in ’08.<\/p>\n

ANDREA MITCHELL:
\nYou got it.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWhere Obama was able to trump her.\u00a0 Well, we’re going to kick off our Meet The Press “Meet the Candidate” series with Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont, who could cause Hillary Clinton some trouble.\u00a0 Sanders is a self-proclaimed Democratic Socialist.\u00a0 He’s the mayor of Burlington, Vermont, from 1981 to 1989.\u00a0 He served eight terms in the House of Representatives, beginning in ’91.<\/p>\n

In ’06 he was elected to the U.S. Senate.\u00a0 Sanders says he’s prepared to run for president, and has spent time in New Hampshire, South Carolina, and Mississippi in recent weeks, talking about what he has called the fight for economic justice.\u00a0 And by the way, unlike Jim Baker, this is Senator Sanders’ first ever appearance on Meet The Press.<\/p>\n

***Begin Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd joining me now is Senator Bernie Sanders, the independent who caucuses with the Democrats. Let me actually just start with that, Senator Sanders. Are you about to switch parties? Are you going to become a member of the Democratic Party if you pursue this presidential campaign?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nWell, I am the longest-serving independent in the history of the United States Congress. That\u2019s how I\u2019ve always won in the state of Vermont. I am thinking about running for president and the issue of whether you run as an independent with the necessity of setting up the fifty-state infrastructure\u2026 running as a Democrat\u2014that\u2019s something that I\u2019m looking at right now.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd you\u2019ve \u2013 it sounds like you\u2019ve ruled out running as an independent or you have not? You could end up doing it that way?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nOne of the reasons I\u2019m going to Iowa is to get a sense of how people feel about it. Look\u2014the truth is, profound anger at both political parties, more and more people are becoming independent, the negative is, how do you set up a fifty-state infrastructure as an independent?<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nI want to read something that was paraphrased to you, it says, \u201c\u2018It is essential,\u2019 Sanders said, \u2018to have someone in the 2016 presidential campaign who is willing to take on Wall Street, address the collapse of the middle class, tackle the spread of poverty, and fiercely oppose cuts to social security and MediCare.\u2019\u201d Is it safe to say if you thought Hillary Clinton were doing that, you wouldn\u2019t be considering this?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nWell, A: I don\u2019t know that Hillary Clinton is running. B: I don\u2019t know what she\u2019s running on. But this is what I do know: I know that the middle class in this country is collapsing. I know that the gap between the very, very rich and everybody else is growing wider.<\/p>\n

I know there is profound anger at the greed on Wall Street and corporate America. Anger at the political establishments. Anger, by the way, at the media establishment.<\/p>\n

The American people want real change and I\u2019ve been taking on the big money interests and the special interests all of my political life.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBut you say you\u2019re, you\u2019re, separating out\u2014are you separating out Hillary Clinton from this? If she were speaking more robustly on these issues, would you be thinking about running?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nChuck, the issue is not Hillary. I-I\u2019ve known Hillary Clinton for many years. I have a lot of respect for Hillary Clinton.<\/p>\n

The question is: At a time when so many people have seen a decline in their standard of living, when the wealthiest people and largest corporations are doing phenomenally well, the American people want change. They want Congress, they want candidates, to stand up to the big money interests.<\/p>\n

So, let Hillary speak for herself. I know where I\u2019m coming from.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nUh, I hear you, it\u2019s uh\u2014rail against this, and I think: Boy, you must be unhappy with President Obama.<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nI think President Obama has done some very good things. I think the level of obstructionism that he has had to face is unprecedented in American history. And in some areas I very clearly disagree with him. I think he should have understood from Day One that the Republicans were not going to cooperate with him.<\/p>\n

I think he should have gone to the people in a more aggressive way and say: \u201cYou know what? The American people want to raise the minimum wage.\u201d We need millions of people to come to Washington, demand us do that. Just can\u2019t sit in a room and negotiate with people who choose not to negotiate.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD
\nSo you believe he\u2014you believe he\u2019s been right on most of his ideas. You just don\u2019t believe he has, uh, pushed them hard enough?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nI think he has been right on some of his ideas. I was on the floor of the Senate for eight-and-a-half hours because I disagreed\u2014<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD
\n\u2013Right.\u2014<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\n\u2013with his continuing tax breaks for the rich. And I have a lot of disagreements with him. But the bottom line is: I think he has not tapped the anger and the frustration that the American people feel on many, many issues.<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nThe only way we bring about change is when the American people become mobilized. And in this coming election, you know what? Sixty percent of the American people are not going to vote.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\n\u2013Are not going to vote.<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nThe Koch brothers and the other billionaires are going to spend hundreds of millions of dollars. That is not a way you bring about change. We\u2019ve got to mobilize the American people.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nLet me ask you on that billionaire front: Is there such thing as a \u2013 If a billionaire agrees with you on issues are you okay with them participating in the process? Or do you think this entire process, whether it\u2019s Tom Steyer or Michael Bloomberg or the Koch brothers?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nChuck, I think Citizens United will go down in history as one of the worst Supreme Court decisions ever. I think it is opening up the road to oligarchy in the United States of America, where the billionaires, like the Koch brothers \u2013<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\n\u2013Left or right?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nLeft or right, but it\u2019s mostly right. Let\u2019s be clear about it. It\u2019s not fair to give\u2014<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThis year it\u2019s, yeah, they have, they\u2019re\u2014<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nAnd it will always be.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\n\u2013 spending more money.<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nIt will always be. Look: The Koch brothers are going to spend four-hundred million dollars. Do you know what their agenda is? Do you know what they believe in? Let me tell you what they believe in. This is what they told us. They want to end Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid. More tax breaks for the rich and large corporations.<\/p>\n

Nobody in America wants that except the billionaire class. And yet they are now able to put hundreds of millions of dollars into the political process. This is a real danger to American democracy.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAlright. You\u2019re headed to Iowa. I guess I\u2019m going to ask it this way about the Democratic Party today. Do you think the Democratic Party is open to a progressive like you? Do you think the Democratic Party is closer to where you are? Or closer to where the Clintons are?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nLet me shock you by saying this. I don\u2019t think it\u2019s just the Democratic Party. I think whether people are Democrats, moderates, or conservatives, there is a profound anger at understanding that the middle class is disappearing, that millions of people are working longer hours for low wages, that 95% of all new income has gone to the top 1%. Not just a Democratic issue. In Vermont, I get a lot of Republican votes.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nRight. But I\u2014I guess I\u2019m going to ask you: Where\u2019s the Democratic Party today? Closer to you or closer to Hillary?<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nI think anybody who speaks to the needs of the working class and the middle class of this country and shows the courage to take on the billionaire class, I think that candidate will do pretty well.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBernie Sanders, the Independent from Vermont. We\u2019ll be watching you. Stay safe on the trail in Iowa over the weekend.<\/p>\n

BERNIE SANDERS:
\nThank you very much.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThank you.<\/p>\n

***End Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nThank you.\u00a0 All right.\u00a0 Murphy, Cooper, Henderson, VandeHei all still here.\u00a0 All right, Vandy.\u00a0 Is the Democratic Party closer to where Hillary Clinton is, or Bernie?<\/p>\n

JIM VANDEHEI:
\nWell, I think, let’s talk about Hillary for a second.\u00a0 Because there is so much talk about her inevitability.\u00a0 And I think there’s three big problems that people are not paying enough attention to.\u00a0 One is what Andrea Mitchell hit on.\u00a0 I don’t know that her theology is where the Democratic Party is right now.\u00a0 Two, she’s been running for three months.<\/p>\n

And that rollout has not been the smooth operating machine that everyone thought.\u00a0 She’s looked disconnected on her wealth issue.\u00a0 And her trying to break away from President Obama looked politically craven.\u00a0 And three, elections are about the future.\u00a0 And her whole argument, look at the ’90s, look at my record.\u00a0 I think the next election, given what we talked about, the beginning of the program, and what’s happening in the world, is going to be way different than everyone’s imagining it.\u00a0 It’s the future.\u00a0 Look–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\n(OVERTALK) to do the best.\u00a0 That’s a pretty–<\/p>\n

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON
\nIt’s a grim case.\u00a0 But the problem is it looks like it’s going to be a field– if Hillary runs, it’ll be Hillary, and it’ll be not Hillary, right?\u00a0 And so far the not-Hillary may be Bernie Sanders will be one.\u00a0 He said the issue is not Hillary.\u00a0 He’s not even willing to take her on right now.\u00a0 Elizabeth Warren–<\/p>\n

JIM VANDEHEI
\nWhich, by the way, I’m sorry, the–<\/p>\n

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON:
\n–does seem– rhetorically, be ready to take Hillary on either.\u00a0 So, you know, you say she’s been running for three months, she’s really been running for, you know, eight, ten, 12 years, or so.\u00a0 And the rest of the field, Martin O’Malley, does he look like he’s ready to run? I think he’s got some operatives in Iowa, this go-round.\u00a0 But–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nYou’ve got to take the fight.\u00a0 Bernie didn’t have the fight.<\/p>\n

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON:
\nYeah.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nI thought he was going to have a little more fight.\u00a0 He’s got the passion for the issues, but he’s not ready to take on Hillary.\u00a0 That tells you a lot, actually.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nI’m not going to bet my house on Bernie-mania breaking out.\u00a0 Though he does have the Vermont disease, like Howard Dean.\u00a0 There’s something about it.\u00a0 But I’ll say this, I’m kind of with Jim.\u00a0 Hillary Clinton is very impressive.\u00a0 Kind of an inside politician.\u00a0 But she’s not that impressive a candidate.\u00a0 I think she’s one very impressive chromosome away from Ed Muskie.\u00a0 And it is going to be a very bumpy, bad–<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nI’m pulling out the old Ed Muskie card.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nwhen you pull out the Ed Muskie card–<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nThink about the parallels.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nYou’re right.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nEstablishment.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nHey, and Bernie Sanders is George McGovern.\u00a0 So there you go.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY
\nDemocrat.\u00a0 In an anti-establishment year, to the right on foreign policy issues, within the spectrum of the Democratic Party.\u00a0 You’re going to hear more of that candidate from the Goldman Sachs wing of the Democratic Party.\u00a0 Bernie’s not going anywhere.\u00a0 But Bernie’s message, in a Democratic primary, in this kind of turbulence is going to be powerful.\u00a0 She’s still gotta be the favorite, if she runs.\u00a0 But–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAll right.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY
\n–I don’t think there’s a lock.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAll right.\u00a0 Helene, I’ll get you in after the break on this one.<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nOh goodie.\u00a0 (LAUGHS)<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nHer eyebrows said \u201cThey\u2019re going Ed Musky on me.\u201d\u00a0 What are you doing.\u00a0 So with that it means I’m going to go to my poll next.\u00a0 Our NBC News Wall Street Journal\u00a0 poll, some numbers here one party has been fearing all summer long.\u00a0 Wait ’til you see these numbers.\u00a0 Plus the growing chorus, calling for NFL commissioner Roger Goodell to step down.\u00a0 All that’s coming up after this next break.<\/p>\n

***Commercial Break***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWhile it is true collective Washington is a bit obsessed with 2016, I should remind you we have an election day that’s in 51 days.\u00a0 And our newest NBC News Wall Street Journal poll did not have some good news for the Democrats.\u00a0 So what had Republicans smiling this week?\u00a0 Let me show you.\u00a0 It starts at the President’s dismal job approval rating.<\/p>\n

We focus on this number because the job rating is one of the better indicators of which party will do well in the mid-terms.\u00a0 And President Obama’s approval still sits at a mere 40 percent this month.\u00a0 And look at this, it was actually higher in September of 2010.\u00a0 Pretty bad year for Democrats.\u00a0 45 percent, that’s when this party lost 63 seats in the house, and six seats in the Senate.<\/p>\n

And check this out.\u00a0 In the same month, in 2006, when a wave of blue washed over Congress, President George W. Bush’s rating was 42 percent.\u00a0 And here’s one more example.\u00a0 The 1994 Republican Tsunami.\u00a0 Bill Clinton’s approval rating had steadily dropped over the course of the year, to 44 percent.\u00a0 And then his party lost 53 seats.\u00a0 So, again, this year that approval rating of President Obama, worse than the last three big midterm elections.<\/p>\n

Let’s move on.\u00a0 You want something else?\u00a0 A majority of the country thinks Republicans will do a better job when it comes to immigration, handling the economy, foreign policy, and national defense.\u00a0 Here’s what our pollsters said about that.<\/p>\n

***Begin Tape***<\/p>\n

BILL MCINTURFF:
\nThese numbers are so positive Republican that among likely voters, where they say Republicans by five points, that’s a big number that has huge meaning across lots of races.<\/p>\n

PETER:
\nIn this poll, first-time Republicans moving up on the feeling thermometer, and Democrats moving down.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\n-that was a– there was some– I saw that too.<\/p>\n

***End Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nPeter’s use of the phrase “feeling thermometer” is simply about the Republican positive rating going up, while the Democratic Party’s positive rating is going down.\u00a0 But is this a full-on Republican wave?\u00a0 Maybe not.\u00a0 Here are three potential yellow flags for the GOP.\u00a0 Number one, there is a female firewall for the Democrats.<\/p>\n

Women favor the Democratic Party by four more points than they did in 2010.\u00a0 Primarily because they believe the Democrats handle women’s issues, and health care issues better than the GOP.\u00a0 Number two, voters just aren’t feeling this election.\u00a0 Only 44 percent of respondents right now say they’re very interested in the mid-terms.<\/p>\n

That number was at 50 percent at this same point in time in 2010.\u00a0 And finally, there’s this.\u00a0 Fifty-three percent, a majority, believe this election is going to change nothing here in Washington.\u00a0 Zip, zilch.\u00a0 Not a surprise, the voters probably are onto something.\u00a0 The bottom line, though, from this poll, Democrats are at a nice edge here.<\/p>\n

They only have a few weeks to right their ship against what is building to become, potentially, another Republican wave.\u00a0 We’ll be right back with HBO’s Bryant Gumbel, on whether NFL Commissioner, Roger Goodell, should keep his job.<\/p>\n

***COMMERCIAL BREAK***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWell, it’s the second week of the NFL season.\u00a0 Analysts would usually be talking Manning and Rodgers today.\u00a0 Instead, it’s Rice and Goodell.<\/p>\n

***Begin Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nIt’s led the nightly news almost the entire week.<\/p>\n

BRIAN WILLIAMS
\nDamage control–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nIn the wake of the Ray Rice domestic violence scandal.\u00a0 Editorials from football towns, calling for NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell to step down, are rolling in.\u00a0 And the damning TMZ Sports video of Ray Rice isn’t the only thing Goodell may have tripped up on.<\/p>\n

ROGER GOODELL:
\nWell, we certainly didn’t know what was on the tape.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nIt’s just the most visual.\u00a0 Greg Hardy of the Carolina Panthers, was convicted of assaulting a woman back in May.\u00a0 He has appealed the decision, and is scheduled to play today.\u00a0 His ex-girlfriend’s protective order is chilling.\u00a0 “Hardy choked me with both hands around my throat.\u00a0 Hardy picked me up over his head and threw me onto a couch covered in assault rifles.”<\/p>\n

Whether Goodell steps down or not, he and Rice have forced the country to take a closer look at domestic violence.\u00a0 According to a CDC survey, one in four women will experience severe physical violence in their lifetime.\u00a0 When you add rape and stalking into the mix, more than one in three American women will experience these types of violence.\u00a0 That’s 42 million women.<\/p>\n

***End Tape***<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nI’m joined now by HBO Real Sports Bryant Gumbel.\u00a0 And Bryant, look, you’ve covered politicians, you’ve covered sports figures, watching the NFL, there’s no doubt that they seem to be handling this worse than any politician I’ve seen in crisis management.\u00a0 Roger Goodell, should he have his job today?<\/p>\n

BRYANT GUMBEL:
\nI don’t know if he should, and it’s not for me to say, Chuck.\u00a0 I mean, I think there’s no evidence to suggest that his job is on the line.\u00a0 His fate is controlled by billionaires who care most about him making them money, not whether he lied or not, not how he bungled this or not.\u00a0 And so until and unless they’re prepared to say, “We care more about a social issue,” than they do about money, I don’t think there’s any reason to suspect he’ll be fired.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWell, you say that– what should they be doing to prove that, you know what, they take domestic violence seriously?\u00a0 I mean, this is– look, we have this– you know, they do October, you do breast cancer awareness.\u00a0 If they do that again this coming October it’s going to scream out of touch to me.<\/p>\n

BRYANT GUMBEL:
\nYeah, I agree with you.\u00a0 But they’re going to pink-wash once again.\u00a0 They’re going to wrap themselves, it’s what they do best.\u00a0 They sell their image very, very well.\u00a0 They sell that they’re sensitive to women, wrap themselves in pink.\u00a0 And yet they don’t punish domestic violence.\u00a0 They suggest they care about players’ safety, yet only medical science and a team of lawyers force them to confront it.\u00a0 They care that they’re great citizens, and wrap themselves in the flag.\u00a0 And yet they operate, it might surprise many Americans, as a tax-exempt nonprofit.\u00a0 The NFL’s very good at masquerading.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWell, it’s funny, you know, so is it us?\u00a0 You know, I look at the problems in Washington, and I always say, you know what, we have to look in the mirror.\u00a0 We elect these folks.\u00a0 If you don’t like what’s going on, it’s up to the fans.\u00a0 We love this sport.\u00a0 And so it allows them carte blanche?<\/p>\n

BRYANT GUMBEL:
\nThe parallel is perfect, Chuck.\u00a0 Just as people say they hate Congress, but they love their Congressman, and send them back in record numbers every time.\u00a0 People say they hate the way the NFL operates, but they love their team.\u00a0 And so as a result, this afternoon, in Carolina, people would be cheering Greg Hardy.\u00a0 In San Francisco they’ll be cheering Ray McDonald.\u00a0 And Thursday night there were fans showing up in Baltimore wearing Ray Rice jerseys.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nShould the owners take some responsibility here?\u00a0\u00a0 I mean, he served at the pleasure of the owners.\u00a0 And I assume that the owners start losing money, then suddenly they might act.<\/p>\n

BRYANT GUMBEL:
\nBingo.\u00a0 Bingo.\u00a0 You saw, as I did, that the female senators sent a letter the other day to Roger Goodell complaining.\u00a0 I would suggest that anybody who really wants to complain should instead complain to Gatorade, Anheuser-Busch, FedEx, Ford Motor Company.\u00a0 Because until and unless you start hitting the NFL in a language it understands, which is money, very little’s going to change.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBryant Gumbel, HBO Real Sports.\u00a0 Bryant, thanks for doing this.\u00a0 Helene Cooper, how do you feel about the NFL today, versus two weeks ago?<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nI’ve never felt that highly about the HFL to begin with.\u00a0 I’m not a big American football– I’m more of a soccer person.\u00a0 But, that said, I mean, I think this whole thing has been– it says a lot more about us, and it says a lot more about the people that watch football.\u00a0 And that’s where you’re going to see, if there’s going to be any kind of impact going forward.\u00a0 I think it’s going to come from that.\u00a0 But you’re also talking about an issue that is so prevalent throughout society.\u00a0 Domestic violence isn’t something that’s only in the NFL.\u00a0 So I think if you can get some sort of discussion, wider discussion, going.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd the NFL, I mean, it better, October better be purple.<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nYeah, yeah.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nBecause purple, it is, a domestic violence awareness month.\u00a0 It better be purple.\u00a0 If the NFL blows this, you know what, I think a lot of us might give up on it.<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nYeah, but you wonder if they go purple in October, will people sort of scream hypocrisy.\u00a0 Does that even say hypocrisy more than the pink-washing that we expect to happen?\u00a0 You know–<\/p>\n

(OVERTALK)<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nYeah, I think there is this discussion about (COUGH) the future of football.\u00a0 We have these cases where all these ex-players are having brain damage, and disorders.\u00a0 So I think most of the underlying question is does NFL becoming boxing?\u00a0 People turned away from boxing.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nYeah, they did.<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nBecause of the brutality, partly, but also there was a sense that it was corrupt.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nIt is.\u00a0 It is.\u00a0 We’d be talking about that.\u00a0 All right.\u00a0 Let me end with a little politics.\u00a0 Murphy and VandeHei, I’ll give you guys the first shot at this.\u00a0 What everybody in Washington knows but won’t say.\u00a0 And that is secretly VandeHei, I’m convinced.\u00a0 I think we know this.\u00a0 Hillary Clinton would love to see the Senate in Republican hands, going into 2016, wouldn’t she?<\/p>\n

JIM VANDEHEI:
\nI think a lot of Democrats would.\u00a0 They never say it in public, because everybody knows virtually nothing is going to happen over the next two years.\u00a0 And Democrats, Hillary Clinton in particular, would love Republicans–<\/p>\n

(OVERTALK)<\/p>\n

JIM VANDEHEI:
\n–Marco Rubio, Rand Paul, to actually have to take ownership of some of the dysfunction.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd just the reverse, secretly, there are a whole bunch of Republicans who are thinking to themselves, “Boy, if we come up a seat short, maybe it’ll allow Democrats to share in the dysfunction.”<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nYeah, there’s a huge opportunity for us if we win the majority.\u00a0 And I think the odds are better we do than we don’t, to grab the microphone, talk about middle class economics, and–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nOh, yeah, uh-huh (affirm).\u00a0 And they\u2019ll do that when?<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nThere’s an opportunity.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nYeah.<\/p>\n

MIKE MURPHY:
\nThere’s also a fear that it’ll just be an American Idol of grievance.\u00a0 And if we do that with the bad calendar we have in ’16, the bad states in the Senate, it could be really bad.\u00a0 Harry Reid may throw the Senate.\u00a0 You can argue it’s in his interest.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nWell, and I wonder.\u00a0 There are some Republicans, Nia, you think they’d love to win the six seats, and make sure it’s not Mitch McConnell that’s the face, too.<\/p>\n

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON:
\nYeah, that’s right.\u00a0 Because, you know, if you’re Marco Rubio, if you’re any of these guys.\u00a0 Ted Cruz, who are thinking about running in 2016, you’re going to have to run on that dysfunction.\u00a0 You’re going to need to run away from it, as well.\u00a0 So, you know, it’s a dicey–<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nAnd, Helen, lot easier for Hillary Clinton to run against a Republican Congress than play this weird Kabuki dance with Barack Obama.<\/p>\n

HELENE COOPER:
\nChuck, I believe that Hillary Clinton (LAUGHS) is not going to put craven politics over her wish for a better life for all of us as Americans.<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nYou say that with– okay.<\/p>\n

(OVERTALK)<\/p>\n

CHUCK TODD:
\nYou’re not supposed to smirk.\u00a0 All right.\u00a0 You guys were great.\u00a0 That’s it for today.\u00a0 We’ll be back next week, because if it’s Sunday, it’s Meet The Press.<\/p>\n

* * *END OF TRANSCRIPT* * *<\/p>\n

# # #<\/p>\n<\/div>\n

Media contacts<\/h4>\n

For more information contact:
\nErika Masonhall
\nNBC News
\no: (212) 664-3230
\nc: (917) 628-8943
\ne: erika.masonhall@nbcuni.com<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

McDonough: \u201cIn as much as we’ve been at war with Al Qaeda since we got here, we’re at war with ISIL\u201d Baker: Obama ISIS plan has \u201cgot some problems with it\u201d New Poll: 70% of Americans Lack Confidence in Obama Mission to Destroy ISIS Gumbel: \u201cThe NFL\u2019s good at masquerading.\u201d SEPTEMBER 14, 2014 — Today\u2019s […]<\/p>\n

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